Author Topic: The Old Man and The Sea - Completed  (Read 2522 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Gatecon

  • “Sir Pundemonium”
  • Administrator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13890
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Pro 12.9
  • Game Center: Gatecon
  • Location: UK
  • Plus+: Gatecon
The Old Man and The Sea - Completed
« on: August 19, 2015, 02:26:42 pm »
The thread for Ernest Hemingway's The Old Man and the Sea discussions

Discussion starts on 25th August

« Last Edit: August 27, 2015, 02:00:34 pm by Gatecon »
Currently playing...umm nothing much.
TWD No-Man’s Land but getting  very bored with it very quickly.

Would still be playing We Rule and Supernauts - if the devs could be bothered.

Gatecon

  • “Sir Pundemonium”
  • Administrator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13890
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Pro 12.9
  • Game Center: Gatecon
  • Location: UK
  • Plus+: Gatecon
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2015, 04:57:42 am »
I wasn't sure if I would enjoy this book as I'm not really a fan of short stories, nor short movies either. I like time to become absorbed in the plot and the characters. Short stories, by their very nature, always feel a bit rushed.

Likewise I wasn't sure if I liked the style of writing for the first half of the book...and yes it does feel like sacrilege to be criticising Hemingway!! I found the constant repetition of words, phrases and thoughts a little annoying for a while until I got used to the fact that the story was being "told" by an old man whose mind tended to wander, and switching between his inner voice and answering himself out loud.

The return journey with the shark attacks was my favourite section of the story with just the skeleton of the marlin left by the time he got back to shore. Similar to Santiago being a skeleton of his former self. The flashbacks to his younger days - his 24 hour arm wrestle etc - were a good contrast to his older body failing him in his battle with the fish.



Oops just realised I'm a day early...apologies!!
Currently playing...umm nothing much.
TWD No-Man’s Land but getting  very bored with it very quickly.

Would still be playing We Rule and Supernauts - if the devs could be bothered.

Ninja12129

  • "George Dubya's Daddy"
  • Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 9327
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Air
  • Game Center: ninja12129
  • Location: Toronto,Canada
  • Plus+: Ninja12129
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2015, 11:51:16 am »
Reading the first few pages, it seemed, like Cuba hasn't changed much since I last visited (about10yrs). The poverty of the old man was still visible but his attitude is also very much Cuban. They're great people that always have a smile on their faces with a positive outlook on life, even though, they don't have the luxuries we do. Anyway, just my initial thoughts.

A fathom- equal to about 6 feet. Learned something new today :).
The description of the old mans' thoughts flow so elegantly. I honestly felt like I was there, close by, while someone was describing him to me. Also, the little tricks and unspoken rules of fishing haven't changed much since the book was written and I use very similar techniques. The no talking rule, especially, made me chuckle as I thought it was just myself and my friends that do it

FISH ON!!! What an epic fight this is!!! The descriptions of the old mans' persistence are painting a vivid picture in my mind. If I had a fish, for every time I heard/said: “'Fish,'' he said, ''I love you and respect you very much. But I will kill you dead before this”, I'd have caught a lot more fish ;).

Funny; reading about his aloud comments, followed by Hemingway's inner thoughts, makes me feel like someone is there on the boat with the old man. As if someone is watching the whole thing and just standing back. 

Epic fight so far but I'm getting to the part where things are starting to get tough for the old man. Not liking this...but he prevails!!!

Those damn sharks. I don't like sharks. I don't like shark week on Discovery Channel. Why do you have to ruin it for the old man. Go get your own food! He went out too far... :'(

Finally, the lights are in sight but the fish is all but gone. Makes me sad. His struggles to reach the hut made me feel his pain.

And, it's over. In his failure to bring in the fish, he achieved his greatest feat. The struggle; the perseverance; the skill, the mental fortitude. All proven by what he did. Damn! That was a good read!

P.S. I HATE SHARKS!!! :D
Good pick Richard. It was a story I always heard people talking about but never read (or knew much about).


Edit: I posted before I read your review and I just realized that I'm early as well ;D.

Groc

  • Alchemist
  • *
  • Posts: 900
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
  • Device: Rusty Tin Can
  • Location: UK was Canada
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2015, 04:11:59 am »
*chuckle* usually I am the early one, but I have just finished reading the book, and read the above reviews.

I have never read Hemingway before, avoiding his books because the people who talked about them seemed to be pretty pretentious and snooty. Not to mention so much analysis, breaking down the book into sentences and wondering what Hemingway meant.

I to had trouble getting into the book, lots of repetition (I HATE REPETITION!) and the ramblings of an old fisherman. I started getting into it though when he was chatting with himself about loving the fish and how sorry he was to have caught it, but was glad he caught it so he could sell it.

I really felt for the gentleman being so far out at sea in what I read to seem as a smallish boat and no supplies. His determination was amazing, I don't know if I could have done that.  He has the attitude of some North American Indians, not killing something unless needed and to say thanks to the fish for giving it's life.

I was getting board when he first caught the fish and it took over a day for him to get it tied to his boat. My interest really picked up with the Sharks though and part of me wanted to be there to help him fend off the sharks so he could have his catch.

I would have like to have read more about the boy - he seemed so respectful of the old man and a good friend by looking after him like he did.

I have done some fishing in the past, and I also followed the rule of no speaking, or moving around much. I am not a great fan of fishing though - had the life scared out of me as someone caught me on the back with a hook and it almost went into my skin.

It was an interesting read, I have had many conversations with myself like the old man did.  :-)

I hate sharks too - nasty things that they are grrr...


Aberfitchjr

  • Dark Wizard
  • ****
  • Posts: 541
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Android username: Aberfitchjr
  • Device: Android phone
  • Game Center: Aberfitchjr
  • Location: Georgia
  • Plus+: Aberfitchjr
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2015, 10:33:39 am »
I read this book in 7th grade and I absolutely hated reading but.... BUT loved it as a kid and now reading it again as an adult many years later I had a feeling of nostalgia!  I remember my emotions I had as a kid feeling sorry for the Marlin and how he gave praise and honor to the Marlin and referred to the Marlin as a brother... those feeling as a kid came rushing back to me and it was PRICELESS... when I read those parts of being drug out to Sea to battle the Marlin for over 2 days and building a relationship of Respect and Honor with the Marlin, having his 1 on 1 time to reflect on what it would be like if he was the Marlin realizing both their struggles to live and fighting hard to stay alive... and in the end despite the misfortune of the Sharks the Old Man gets his well deserve recognition of a true great fisherman!!!

I now truly believe it is bc of this book I gained a huge respect for all living "beings"
Let me explain this reasoning if I may...  around this time and age being in 7th grade (which I could have skipped and gone straight to 9th grade and by pass middle school but parents sheltered me too much and did not let me leave my friends behind  >:() but I digress... ok anyways at the time of being a 7th grader I still did not appreciate and respect the rights of other small living beings and creatures that roamed in and out of our home.  I can thank Mr. Hemingway himself for my awakening of "respecting all live beings" such as ants, rollie pollies, slugs, bugs of all sorts, Spiders now my favorite along with Ants  ^-^ and especially Fish!  Once my parents explained to me how those feelings were being projected to the audience and understanding not only the fight of the Old Man Santiago has to go through to make a living but also respect the fight even Marlins have to struggle with daily to live...

It was at that very moment in time I remembered as a kid how I truly transformed and started feeling guilty for all the ants I smashed and ant beds I blew up with fireworks and slugs I unfortunately and ignorantly poored salt on and watched them react (to this day I still have tremendous guilt for what I did to those slugs!!!)  :-[...  I had an epiphany and told myself I will do what it takes to help them if I see them and to this day I still go out of my way to help the world of little creatures find their way   ^-^

"No good book has ever been written that has in it symbols arrived at beforehand and stuck in .... I tried to make a real old man, a real boy, a real sea and a real fish and real sharks. But if I made them good and true enough they would mean many things"  - Ernest Hemingway in 1954

I always felt there was a personal message to his audience with this book... as a kid I did not really appreciate the emotions on a broad spectrum well bc I was just a kid... but going back and reading it again after my life experiences so far as an adult I can respect the great powerful message that I received and the life lessons I truly learned and realized from this Great book, The Old Man & The Sea!



 
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 10:44:47 am by Aberfitchjr »

Gatecon

  • “Sir Pundemonium”
  • Administrator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13890
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Pro 12.9
  • Game Center: Gatecon
  • Location: UK
  • Plus+: Gatecon
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2015, 12:16:40 pm »
I also had the nagging feeling during the last quarter of the book that the old man wasn't going to make it back to shore. It really could have gone either way and I wonder if Hemingway even considered an alternate ending.
Currently playing...umm nothing much.
TWD No-Man’s Land but getting  very bored with it very quickly.

Would still be playing We Rule and Supernauts - if the devs could be bothered.

Selkii

  • Epic Ruler
  • ****
  • Posts: 3589
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad 2
  • Game Center: Selkiii
  • Location: No.Calif + BC Canada
  • Plus+: Selkii
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2015, 01:01:04 pm »
The Old man and the Sea

I, too, hate repetition, but, in this book, it never bothered me. It paralleled the Old Man's life and, for me, enhanced the story.

As for symbolism, Hemingway, through the Old Man, says what he means straight out. There is no need to dig for deeper meanings. It is all raw and true.

I remember my English teacher likening "Old Man and the Sea" to "Jaws" or "Moby TellySavalas" - man vs. his sea-demon. I so disagree! The fish in OMATS is more sympathetic, an aquatic equivalent of the Old Man...doing what must be done. I vacillated between cheering on the fish, then the man, wanting both to win, knowing already what was to come. And, then, I read Hemingway's words:

"You are killing me, fish, the old man thought. But you have a right to. Never have I seen a greater, or more beautiful, or a calmer or more noble thing than you, brother. Come on and kill me. I do not care who kills who."

How had I dismissed this as a mere story - boring, at that - when first read? Even as a 12-year-old, how had I missed what was plainly said? The Old Man was equally beautiful and noble.

There is so much depth and brilliance to the characters, the man and the marlin, to the point that I felt I now know both intimately. 

What came as an even greater shock is that I knew someone very much like this through stories my mother told me of my grandfather - a farmer, guitar maker and sometime coffin builder. It made sense to why one of my mother's favorite phrases was, "we do what we must," now taking on multiple, complex - and personal - meanings. It made me realize how far removed I've become from my heritage and now wish I had asked more questions before those who could answer were gone.

The Old Man speaks of sin, then, a few pages later, thinks:

"'Ay,' he said aloud. There is no translation for this word and perhaps it is just a noise such as a man might make, involuntarily, feeling the nail go through his hands and into the wood"

as though he were being crucified for his sins and the sharks are his penance.

I have never highlighted an Ebook, yet I highlighted over a dozen. Some of my favorites:

"No one should be alone in their old age, he thought. But it is unavoidable."

"The sail...looked like the flag of permanent defeat."

"brown blotches of the benevolent cancer" (where no cancer is benevolent)

His scars were "as old as erosions in a fishless desert."

And, lastly,

"'Thank you,' the old man said. He was too simple to wonder when he had attained humility. But he knew he had attained it and he knew it was not disgraceful and it carried no loss of true pride."
Visit Selkii's Flickr Photostream

“If you want to be a better photographer, stand in front of more interesting stuff." ~ Jim Richardson, NatGeo photographer

"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus." ~ Mark Twain

Gatecon

  • “Sir Pundemonium”
  • Administrator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13890
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Pro 12.9
  • Game Center: Gatecon
  • Location: UK
  • Plus+: Gatecon
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2015, 01:38:31 pm »
I love the collection of quotes Selkii. I must try the highlighter on the next book if it warrants it.
Unexpectedly, I keep going back over the story in my mind, 48 hours after finishing the read. So it must have had an effect.

I'm also glad that I can now say I have read some Hemingway. Does anyone have a favourote of his that I should read next?

Great reviews everyone.
Currently playing...umm nothing much.
TWD No-Man’s Land but getting  very bored with it very quickly.

Would still be playing We Rule and Supernauts - if the devs could be bothered.

Selkii

  • Epic Ruler
  • ****
  • Posts: 3589
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad 2
  • Game Center: Selkiii
  • Location: No.Calif + BC Canada
  • Plus+: Selkii
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2015, 05:45:33 pm »
I love the collection of quotes Selkii. I must try the highlighter on the next book if it warrants it.
Unexpectedly, I keep going back over the story in my mind, 48 hours after finishing the read. So it must have had an effect.

I'm also glad that I can now say I have read some Hemingway. Does anyone have a favourote of his that I should read next?

Great reviews everyone.

I started reading OMATS using iBook, but switched to The Kindle app as I like its features better, especially its highlighter/copy.

I always thought I didn't like Hemingway - too chauvinistic. Reading this one book doesn't mean that still isn't true in general, so I don't have any suggestions...yet.

PS whenever I read or watch a movie I initially don't like, then have it keep popping up in my brain, that means I have to read/watch it again because I must have been impressed with something. If I truly don't like a book/movie, it is erased...no waste of brain cells. ::)
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 05:47:54 pm by Selkii »
Visit Selkii's Flickr Photostream

“If you want to be a better photographer, stand in front of more interesting stuff." ~ Jim Richardson, NatGeo photographer

"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus." ~ Mark Twain

wilyone

  • Alchemist
  • *
  • Posts: 903
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Pro 12.9
  • Game Center: wilyone
  • Location: SF Bay Area, CA
  • Plus+: WilyOne
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2015, 08:00:16 pm »
It was an interesting short story.  I am not sure I liked it.  I know I didn't hate it. I can see why the story resonates more with some of you.  Perhaps I'm just a little worn out lately and cannot enjoy the pyrrhic victory. Sure the Old Man brings back the fish, but the cost is, well, as he said, the fish was killing him and he didn't care how. 




Ninja12129

  • "George Dubya's Daddy"
  • Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 9327
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Air
  • Game Center: ninja12129
  • Location: Toronto,Canada
  • Plus+: Ninja12129
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2015, 08:19:31 pm »
So, now that we've all had our chance to chime in, I'm starting to realize that there are a tonne of classics I've never read. Mainly, because I grew up in Greece, and these books weren't available to me, in a town of 2000. But ask me about Greek mythology and some of the Classical Greek stories (Iliad and Odyssey) and I'm your man.
Alas, I started thinking about some of the books people would tell me they've read and I keep coming back to one: Frankenstein! I don't really know the story or the ending so I figured I'd throw it out there as a suggestion. It's listed as 260 pages, which should accommodate most of our real lives without burdening us. Opinions and any other suggestions?

Selkii

  • Epic Ruler
  • ****
  • Posts: 3589
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad 2
  • Game Center: Selkiii
  • Location: No.Calif + BC Canada
  • Plus+: Selkii
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2015, 11:13:29 pm »
So, now that we've all had our chance to chime in, I'm starting to realize that there are a tonne of classics I've never read. Mainly, because I grew up in Greece, and these books weren't available to me, in a town of 2000. But ask me about Greek mythology and some of the Classical Greek stories (Iliad and Odyssey) and I'm your man.
Alas, I started thinking about some of the books people would tell me they've read and I keep coming back to one: Frankenstein! I don't really know the story or the ending so I figured I'd throw it out there as a suggestion. It's listed as 260 pages, which should accommodate most of our real lives without burdening us. Opinions and any other suggestions?

I would read Frankenstein - again - at the drop of a hat. Another horror classic everyone should read is Dracula. This "revival of classics" bug bit Don. I was shocked to find he was reading the Sherlock Holmes series which he has never read before beginning with Hound of the Baskervilles. He is more of a Tom Clancy or political non-fiction sort of guy.
Visit Selkii's Flickr Photostream

“If you want to be a better photographer, stand in front of more interesting stuff." ~ Jim Richardson, NatGeo photographer

"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus." ~ Mark Twain

Gatecon

  • “Sir Pundemonium”
  • Administrator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13890
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Device: iPad Pro 12.9
  • Game Center: Gatecon
  • Location: UK
  • Plus+: Gatecon
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2015, 11:33:52 pm »
Yup I'm definitely up for Frankenstein, or the Modern Prometheus next, especially as it's one of the many classics free in the Kindle Store.
Currently playing...umm nothing much.
TWD No-Man’s Land but getting  very bored with it very quickly.

Would still be playing We Rule and Supernauts - if the devs could be bothered.

Groc

  • Alchemist
  • *
  • Posts: 900
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
  • Device: Rusty Tin Can
  • Location: UK was Canada
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2015, 11:36:40 pm »
So, now that we've all had our chance to chime in, I'm starting to realize that there are a tonne of classics I've never read. Mainly, because I grew up in Greece, and these books weren't available to me, in a town of 2000. But ask me about Greek mythology and some of the Classical Greek stories (Iliad and Odyssey) and I'm your man.
Alas, I started thinking about some of the books people would tell me they've read and I keep coming back to one: Frankenstein! I don't really know the story or the ending so I figured I'd throw it out there as a suggestion. It's listed as 260 pages, which should accommodate most of our real lives without burdening us. Opinions and any other suggestions?

I would read Frankenstein - again - at the drop of a hat. Another horror classic everyone should read is Dracula. This "revival of classics" bug bit Don. I was shocked to find he was reading the Sherlock Holmes series which he has never read before beginning with Hound of the Baskervilles. He is more of a Tom Clancy or political non-fiction sort of guy.

OOohhhOohh ..  count me in for Frankenstein!!  I have always wanted to read it, but just haven't yet, the same with Dracula. :-)   

Groc

  • Alchemist
  • *
  • Posts: 900
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
  • Device: Rusty Tin Can
  • Location: UK was Canada
Re: The Old Man and The Sea - Discussing
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2015, 11:40:35 pm »
Yup I'm definitely up for Frankenstein, or the Modern Prometheus next, especially as it's one of the many classics free in the Kindle Store.

*chuckle* had to search on the Modern Prometheus as I thought it might be a different book! :-)